Wednesday, July 9, 2008
posted by Spencerblog at
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The Pen leads to action, because thought proceeds (or should proceed) action.Or not... as in the case of the Sudan.Without men of action, willing to fight and die for a cause, like freedom or the enslavement of other men, words are just words.The Declaration wouldn't have meant squat if men hadn't been willing to actually fight for their independence.Today's intellectual left finds plenty of things worth wrting for, but not fighting for.
DaveYea. That was a great reenlistment video that Gil posted, but I didn't see him or Randal amongst the crowd.
As I've pointed out before you don't have to be a cop to respect and admire the job that they do.David,You don't teach school in Chester. Does that mean your opinion about funding inner city schools is worthless? Bob, I don't know what you do, but I bet there are plenty of things you don't do that you admire and support.The assertion that unless you are actually involved in fighting a war, you have no business supporting it, is a pretty childish argument.Bob, you're proud of your son's service aren't you?
GilI'm very proud of my son's service. I'm proud of every member of my family that has served. Four generations. Actually more than that. I have records that go back to the Civil War. I'm sure that both you and Randal had the opportunity to serve in the military, and for one reason or another, decided not to. I supported the invasion of Afghanistan, and the hunt for Bin Laden after 9/11, but to this day, I still think it was foolish to take the focus off of Afghanistan to invade Iraq. Didn't make sense then, doesn't now. Now we are paying the price for this diversion as we see a regrouped Taliban in Afghanistan.I've read your column for years, and sometimes agree and enjoy your take on things, but I think your support of the war in Iraq, and your critisism of those who oppose that war, is way off base. Your insinuation that those opposed to the war in Iraq would not be interested in that video is a bit insulting, and I was pissed. OK. I'm over it. But, one can, in fact, support our military, and at the same time oppose this governments wreckless use and disregard for the safety of that military. This encompases the foolish use of the military (an invasion based on cherry picked and bad intel), to the short changing of proper equiptment for our troops (my son was told he would have an uparmored humvee for his mission in Iraq. Never happened), to the shoddy treatment of our military when they come home and are in need of medical or social services. Are we supposed to keep quiet about these things? Does it make us unpatriotic when we speak up about these issues? What am I, as a parent, supposed to think about this administration, when it sends my son to war, but fails to provide him with the proper equiptment? Are you a believer in "my country right or wrong", or would you prefer to have people speak out when we believe our government is acting improperly?By the way, did you get the magazine article that I sent you about my son?
The assertion that unless you are actually involved in fighting a war, you have no business supporting it, is a pretty childish argument.Yep. But that is the Modern Lib mentality. This is known as the Michael Moore Standard. And, yes, it is crap.
Bob,You realize that by supporting the war in Afghanistan and not being willing to join that fight yourself that makes you a coward and "chickenhawk" in your friend Diano's book.I think reasonable people can disagree about whether deposing Saddam Hussein was a wise thing to do. I even think reasonable can disagree about whether we should have involved ourselves in WWI, WWII, Korea, and/or Vietnam.I think reasonable people can disagree about how much money ought to be poured into failing public schools vs. charter schools and vouchers for poor kids and their families.Diano is willing to have his money spent to support failing public schools in Chester but he isn't willing to go down there and serve on the front lines himself. By his own definition that makes him a coward, an educational chickenhawk if you will. This is known as being hoisted on your own petard. There were and are rational arguments for military intervention in Afghanistan and Iraq, the Sudan and elsewhere, for that matter, just are there are rational arguments to make for staying out out those places.Diano refuses to accept that. To him, it's all very clear, black and white. Bush, Cheney and Republicans in general are stupid and, worse, evil. He and Randal are two sides of the same coin.Of course "one can, in fact, support our military, and at the same time oppose this governments wreckless use and disregard for the safety of that military."But it also helps to realize that terms like "wreckless use" (even when spelled correctly) and "disregard" for safety are loaded terms. They are opinions, with which reasonable people can disagree.It would be unreasonable to suggest no mistakes have been made in the fighting of this war, but it would also be unreasonable to expect no mistakes to be made. We have the best trained military in the world and despite the fact that many humvees weren't up armored as quickly as they should have been in Iraq, we have the best equipped military ever.Wouldn't your son agree with that? Does he agree with everything you say about the Iraq war. Or does he have his own opinions, different from yours?BTW, yes, I got the magazine article. But I have mislaid it and can't find it now. Please send me another.
This is known as being hoisted on your own petard.Dave sure is a petard. Lol... Good stuff, Gil.But, once again, don't compare me to that dope. I'm not all about the war, really. I'm just anti- Libs who have used the war as a pretense to attack their own president and country. I'm like you and just don't feel the war and those who have waged it are as bad as they have been made out to be by shrill partisans.
Diano's reply made me laugh.He already put in his time working as a contractor for the military during the cold war? That translates into he was on the government dole for some IT work.Man, that's putting yourself in Harm's Way. He doesn't teach in Chester because he's not teacher certified. Why not get certified? That what he demands of those who support the war effort. If you're old and out of shape there's still something you could do. (Clean latrines.) Why not clean the bathrooms at Chester High? The unions wouldn't like it but he could find other ways to help out. He could tutor kids, improve their computer skills, or just be a Big Brother to a fatherless teenager. But he doesn't do it. He must be a COWARD! Or a racist. What other explanation can there be?That is the quality of Diano's argument. It's so weak, it's actually funny. Ad hominem attacks gamely trying to pass themselves off as the insights of a genius.
SpencerblogGil, who are you? The word police? Ok, so I was reckless with wreckless. Big deal. If they ever take away your column, maybe you can get a job as a proof reader for the Thymes.All kidding aside....I have discussed the war with my son. He believed in his mission in Iraq, as he did in Kosovo. I respect him for that, although I must say that my son is not political. He is interested in soldiering, period. My daughter in law was also military until last year. She had served for about 8 years. She is political, and pretty much agrees with me on Iraq and Afghanistan. As you can imagine, I get to talk with alot of military. I have found that there are just as many who question the administrations decission to go into Iraq, as there are who fully support it. Now, you may consider my use of the term "reckless use of the military" (did I get it right?),as opinion, but my claim that this government shows a "disregard" for the safety of our troops, is quite often fact, and not opinion. Who can forget the soldiers calling Rumsfeld (what ever became of Rummy?)on the carpet,because they were stuck with aging vehicles that lacked proper armor to protect against roadside bombs? Of course, I know from my son's experience, that this was fact. This was in 2004. A year before my son was there. We've all heard of military decissions made with more of an eye towards business at the expense of those on the ground. Or how about the administrations failure to devise a plan to secure Iraq after the invasion, bespite Powels warning to Bush that "if you break it, you bought it"?. Even his own father, in his book "A world transformed" warned of what would become of Iraq, if we removed Saddam. Is that failure to plan to secure Iraq, even after these warnings, not a "disregard" for the safety of our military?BTW, good column today. Wasn't quite sure where it was going until the last few sentences. You still have a little Dexter in you. I'll resend the story on my son.
But he doesn't do it. He must be a COWARD! Or a racist. What other explanation can there be?That is the quality of Diano's argument. It's so weak, it's actually funny. Ad hominem attacks gamely trying to pass themselves off as the insights of a genius.LOL! Hoisting Dishonest Dave on his own petardation, G? Lol…Bob can’t seem to understand that since he is here at home fighting against what his brave soldier son is fight for –and believes in- that this is essentially undermining his own son. Or, as I call it, stabbing his soldier son in the back. Sure, anyone can understand his anxiety about having his kid over there, but must he turn against his president and country just to exercise those feelings? Should anything happen to his boy, I see another Cindy Sheehan in the making. And in doing so Bob would soil his brave son’s memory, thus once again stabbing the kid in the back.
Do you understand that all your wiggling and distortions are the same as lying, Dishonest Dave? Do you get this? It doesn’t reflect well on all your “smarts” and “education” that you ever have to resort to such lame tactics in order to make your “points”. Maybe instead of all that spinning and lying, it is time you reexamined the defective Libism product your are trying to push which requires you to lie in order to sell it to others. That’s what a truly smart person would do.
SpencerblogAlthough the proof reader comment was made in jest, maybe we should rethink it. Take a look at the headlines on page 12 of the Friday, July 11th Times! "Iran files new missiles" and the headline to the right of that ""U.N. launches prove into Bhutto slaying"Also- sorry that my post to this blog led Randal to write -Gil-"I'm like you". You want to comment on that Gil? LOL
Diano: "I actually DID try to enlist, but didn't make the cut, so I found another way to serve by country.)"Make the cut? Maybe it's none of my business but I can't help but wondering what kept him out.But I won't ask, and he doesn't have to tell.I'm also curious as to the "other way" he "served his country." As a member of the loyal opposition? Or was there some other, more concrete way?
David,Thank you for sharing. Just a one small criticism. When writing about yourself it's unseemly to sing your own praises. You're not applying for a job here.Just a suggestion.
Oh, I thought you were just patting yourself on the back. I didn't know you had a "point."
It felt almost like something had knocked me down suddenly.It was likely your cowardice that slapped you up side the head.
You want me to apply to be a recruiter now??
Anything to undermine to U.S. Military, eh, DDD? And don’t try to project your failures onto others just because cowardly womanly you failed your test. Lol…
Play all the games ya want to, DDD, it won’t hide the fact that you are a cowardly chicken-dove America-hater.
Cute. But who has time for your silly crypto games?
As long as I don't have to read your inanity, that's fine. I've heard it all before from your broken record. You should always post in this manner.
My, you sure are humping me today. In every thread. It is hugely funny that inconsequential little old me means SO much to you! Lol… Pathetic. You have yet to “defeat” anyone here… me, Gil, Jonas, Mr. Shields… And certainly your silly crypto “gotcha” game is in line with these other failings. Only this way we all win because we don’t need to read your childish and offensive dishonesty. You are the joke of this board, DDD, with nicknames like Dishonest Dave and Spinzie. But you’re “winning”… Lol… Grasping is more like it. Carry on.
The Bush Card??! LMAO! I'll take the point, lame as it is. Just, dude, I'm not gay, so forget it. Ew.
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